Author Topic: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA  (Read 2696 times)

LordNagetiere

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2014, 02:39:51 pm »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the current issue has virtually nothing to do with Zaush and rape but just how poorly FA's administration and moderation in general manage PR.

People keep trying to tie the Zaush/Ferality thing into this, and I just don't see that as a cohesive argument. People are leaving FA because it's a popularity-ocracy, the PR is deplorable, and the site is badly managed. All good reasons to leave, but unrelated to the events three years ago that truthfully Dragoneer could not have done anything meaningful about apart tell Ferality to go the police as she already knew she should.
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graeme

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2014, 05:04:06 pm »
So you missed the leak notes where Neer basically suggested it not be pursued legally?

But yes, I agree, the bigger point here should be that FA is run like a high school clique, and not like a professional site should be.

rodox_video

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2014, 05:57:47 pm »
the two issues are now permanently intertwined thanks to the events of three years ago and last month

which is just peachy for the victim, i'm sure
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LordNagetiere

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2014, 10:49:56 pm »
Rodox, if the issues were so entwined people would have been jumping ship three years ago. It's background, not motive. The censorship seems to be the biggest motive, and while some of those poor administrative decisions involve Zaush, none are truly about the incident of 3 years ago, rather the modern fallout of Zaush being an egotistical popufur who gets gigs for merely being such.

Same issue would have happened if he was a eunuch (and still that douchy), granted it wouldn't have sound as stinging as 'he's a rapist'.

So you missed the leak notes where Neer basically suggested it not be pursued legally?

Yes, missed it, probably because it doesn't exist. Here's the leaked notes, correct?

https://forums.vivisector.org/index.php?topic=442.msg4109#msg4109

Note 1 F to D: Synopsis: Ferality pleads her case, but does not mention who the rapist is beyond a popular artist on this site, she turns to Dragoneer to ask about whether to do anything on FA, but in truth she's mostly writing to herself. The last paragraph especially seems tuned less to something you'd say to a site admin and something moreso you'd say to a psychiatrist on a couch.

Note 2 D to F: "More info plz"

The line everyone seems to say is a threat:

Plus (don't take this the wrong way) going public with anything like this turns dirty. Sometimes it's best to know the circumstances between all involved.

This is said before she says it's Zaush*, and the way it's written implies he would take it public if need be, a bit narcissistic, and not useful, but not a threat. Also, I'd like to point out, he was exactly right, it turned dirty.

Note 3 F to D: It's Zaush, and the victim reveals the whole ordeal.

Note 4 D to F: "Lol, I dunno."

*Unless Wan contacted him earlier saying "yo I raped this chick, silence her!" in which case why don't we have that note?

Dragoneer handles this poorly, but he's not a counselor. It's actually quite hard to hold Piche in contempt for this when he merely doesn't do anything. That's not active crony-shielding of Wan. That's not intimidation. Unlike AIDS and Reagan, there's very little FA could have done for Ferality, in terms of moderation staff.

Ferality even seems to admit much of this...

Quote
Hey guys, Dragoneer has stayed in contact with me through this. I wanted to post my thoughts.

First and foremost, I am going to seek counseling on this issue and learn about what steps to take from there. I've received a lot of information that suggests that I am not alone in my experiences.

I shouldn't have gone to Dragoneer (or anyone on the internet) about this, but rather I should have talked to someone with the legal knowledge and authority necessary to guide me. I know this sensitive information has affected others than myself, and for this mistake I apologize profusely.

I didn't feel like Dragoneer sided with anyone. I didn't feel like he was trying to tell me to keep quiet and protect Zaush. Dragoneer knew things could get ugly for me if I had simply posted a journal accusing Zaush, and wanted me to be mindful of my decision on this regard. I appreciate his input even though I do not agree with everything he said about the situation.

People are leaving FA because FA is a shithole run like a cross between a two-bit gang and a high-school government class. People are not showing solidarity to a victim by holding pretty much the opposite view of said victim. Critical difference.

Honestly, it's pretty clear he most likely coerced her into sex, but that is not the current issue, and it's not something the police acted on. Why would you hold FA of all places to a 'higher standard'? Don't want Zaush with admin powers? Sensible, but that should be a red flag even without the rape accusations.

If anyone really honestly feels this strongly about a sense of justice regarding all of this, they should contact a hitman rather than moving to Weasyl.
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Gryphoneer

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2014, 03:37:24 am »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the current issue has virtually nothing to do with Zaush and rape but just how poorly FA's administration and moderation in general manage PR.

People keep trying to tie the Zaush/Ferality thing into this, and I just don't see that as a cohesive argument. People are leaving FA because it's a popularity-ocracy, the PR is deplorable, and the site is badly managed. All good reasons to leave, but unrelated to the events three years ago that truthfully Dragoneer could not have done anything meaningful about apart tell Ferality to go the police as she already knew she should.
But FA has been this way ever since Piche took over. There's no real change in status of how things are run over there, and even the "whoops forgot an entire coding team after a month or two" incident is only medium-sized in comparison to earlier fuck-ups. There's nothing novel to prompt such a migration if you disregard the rape angle.

Furries may keep quiet about his past and fap off to his smut, but they're less happy with a known rapist - oh, I forgot, the politically correct term is sexual predator 'cause he could evade the law pull an O. J. it didn't come to an arrest - in charge.

Furry pretty much runs on small town mentality. You may tolerate a Bob Ewell living in your village, but it's a whole nother story if he becomes a councilman.

LordNagetiere

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2014, 03:10:06 pm »
There's nothing novel to prompt such a migration if you disregard the rape angle.

I thought that was kind of my point. People are drumming up the rape angle (against what the victim seemed to want) specifically to use it as an 'AHA!' against Dragoneer that they really didn't need in the first place. That seems actually quite disrespectful to the victim, using her experience in that way. Am I the only one to see that?

I get the smalltown angle, but even a non-rapist Wan is still a popufur ego-machine who shouldn't be in charge. I don't see what amounts to at best, 10% of furry artists migrating to other sites to be an effective protest though. It seems more like mental masturbation than a solution.
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camellia sinensis

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2014, 07:54:37 pm »
I don't know about you but I'm not exactly enthused about using a site that puts a rapist on staff and protects them from criticism. For most of the people I've seen, the migration is as much an act of trying to ensure one's own safety as it is a protest against corrupt administration.

rodox_video

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2014, 08:13:07 pm »
Does everything Wan has done so far- the Twitter shit, both FA journals and the spreading of chatlogs - constitute witness intimidation, or does that require him to have been formally charged?
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Conan

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #28 on: February 01, 2014, 11:53:54 pm »
Very little of what has taken place over the past few weeks has to do with Zaush directly. This is the outcome of the past several years of gross incompetence from Dragoneer and friends.

Just look through the older threads here and it's watching a perfect storm. 2013 was NOT a good year for them. They ordered new hardware and sat on it for up to ten months, fucked up two database migrations, pushed out broken and unfinished new features, attempted to release a very poorly done bastardization of the original "new UI", and had numerous incidents with staff leaving or staff controversy. Ultimately, in the past few months, they had to deal with a week long site outage that ultimately reminds people that Weasyl exists. Weasyl's traffic never drops to the point it was at prior to this.

Then the next domino falls. Chase is made Forum King. The shitstorm takes off. Dragoneer stomps around looking like a fool. He admits that he won't do anything because Chase is a friend. He blathers on and tries to lie his way out, claiming he didn't know if Chase had ever done anything with dogs, despite Chase admitting it to him in one of the leaked notes.

That barely dies off before Zaush starts indicating he's now on a team to fix FA. Other coders come forward to say they were already doing something similar, with Dragoneer's permission. Normal people can see that the situation is ready to blow up at any moment, and HOW it will blow up, but...

Dragoneer, apparently caring more about making a handful of sycophants like him, decides to admit that, yes, indeed, Zaush, the man surrounded by rape allegations and is utterly poisonous to the site's PR, is the team lead for the 6th or 7th attempt at rewriting FA. I think you know the rest of the story from here.

It's a perfect storm of a dozen little problems culminating in two giant PR disasters, giving people annoyed with the site decent excuses to leave.

chewy_lemon

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2014, 12:59:46 am »
Does everything Wan has done so far- the Twitter shit, both FA journals and the spreading of chatlogs - constitute witness intimidation, or does that require him to have been formally charged?

Are there any screencaps or pastebins of the first journal?

graeme

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #30 on: February 04, 2014, 10:07:26 am »
Doesn't matter if there are screen-grabs or what ever.

People saying things on a porn site and someone taking a screenshot of it is hearsay.  It's not admissible in court, it's not really actionable for purposes of charging someone.

Point blank, you want evidence of witness intimidation, you have to have a blatant quid pro quo.

"YOU talk to the police, and I will kill YOU"
"If SHE says something to her employer that gets me fired, I WILL hurt her kids"

etc. 

Nothing done here is witness intimidation.

rodox_video

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #31 on: February 04, 2014, 10:42:31 am »
I guess that makes sense. So there has to be an explicit threat of physical retaliation?
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Gryphoneer

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #32 on: February 04, 2014, 10:46:46 am »
Does everything Wan has done so far- the Twitter shit, both FA journals and the spreading of chatlogs - constitute witness intimidation, or does that require him to have been formally charged?
Wait a sec, I will consult our family e-lawyer!

you have to have a blatant quid pro quo
you keep using that word

graeme

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #33 on: February 04, 2014, 01:38:53 pm »
Yeah?

Quid pro quo means "Something for something" in latin,  so thanks.

Not a lawyer, though.  Just dealt with a lot of furry bullshit on line through my lawyer.  Got quite used to this type of thing when I ran a furry site long ago.  Reason #12451 NOT to run furry sites ;D





Gryphoneer

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #34 on: February 05, 2014, 06:32:04 am »
The phrase is only used if both what you give and what you will receive in return are beneficial to the other party, and that's still just armchair lawyering.

ProvincialTwit

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Re: Furry's favorite rapist wants to fix FA
« Reply #35 on: February 05, 2014, 10:20:31 pm »
The phrase is only used if both what you give and what you will receive in return are beneficial to the other party, and that's still just armchair lawyering.

Well clearly he was givin' her the D, and at least in his mind that was beneficial to the other party ifyouknowwhatimean~