Author Topic: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct  (Read 12457 times)

Jim Demintia

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2012, 05:49:32 pm »
re: the squad having a lawyer. In the northeastern United States it is very common for the structure of small-town emergency services to be such that a formerly loosely-structured volunteer squad has incorporated as some kind of legal entity (non-profit, or whatever, I don't know) and gets a periodic contract with the local government to provide services. It is very possible someone had an axe to grind with these people, and whatever happened (or didn't) is being used against them in an unrelated dispute.

Whatever state law New Jersey has regarding such arrangements probably addresses the issue of legal representation and/or dispute resolution.

It seems very plausible to me that this guy was not too quiet about the furry thing, and everyone kinda knew about it - knew enough to know they didn't want to know more, and tolerated it, until someone decided to use it in a personal attack to gain the upper hand in some sort of unrelated business or administrative squabble.

I don't know. I agree with quantityorama that someone is trying to distract from something. I'm not sure that anything outside of this specific situation is related (ie. sexual assaults at AC, which, by the way, is anyone really surprised there? Have fun spinnin' that story in the local press, Sam.), but it seems like there's no point in doing much of anything but waiting until something authoritative comes out (ie. town meeting minutes that address the issues). Because right now, all we have are FA journals from this guy. Which borders on worthless - ie. not even worth reading.
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ProvincialTwit

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2012, 08:33:58 pm »
I'm not quite ready to believe this is part of any sort of 'personal attack' against the people who were organizing/running this thing, and as Conan has shown, the bullshit about them losing $55k in budget is exactly that - bullshit.

Another possibility comes to mind - maybe the place where they were holding the event just plain got sick of furries.  I mean, it's essentially the same thing they're claiming happened, only without the oh-so-sensational reason of people getting caught screwing in public.

Think about it.  A group of people who already can't grasp the finer points of acceptable public behavior getting thrown out of a location for activities that, to them, seem 'normal' and 'harmless'?  True, terrible behavior runs amok at conventions, but the difference there is that contracts and money are involved, and certain things can be overlooked or smoothed out with 'palm grease', so to speak.  I get the impression that there was no money paid to whatever locale was hosting the event; maybe they left a mess, maybe they were too loud, maybe they were just obnoxious.

Looking back over the quoted FA posts, the guy says that a councilman came by to take pictures after receiving a complaint from a neighbor.  Come the fuck on.  If my neighbor is having a party with people being loud, obnoxious or, as is alleged here, screwing in plain view, I'm not going to call a city councilman.  I'm going to call the cops.

And on top of everything else, police and fire departments around the country are cutting staff and budgets like crazy these days, because nobody has any damn money.  Maybe this supposed phone call the poster received from the chief was just to tell him they were letting him go due to downsizing.  This could also very likely have absolutely nothing to do with the party.

So here are my 4 predicted outcome possibilities:
1. The organizers decided they don't want to run it any more, and made up the whole thing to give them an excuse to stop
2. It's the prelude to a witch hunt and some names will be dropped after sufficient fervor has been worked up
3. The venue kicked them out because _____fill in the blank____
4. The organizer got shitcanned and is using this as an excuse

Kirune

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #22 on: June 22, 2012, 03:02:19 am »
The journals outlining details for donating have been deleted.

doubtingwolf

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #23 on: June 22, 2012, 07:21:24 am »
The journals outlining details for donating have been deleted.

Does anyone have them 'capped?  I want to know if the donation URLs are still valid.
After digesting the spotty initial information this whole thing smacked of a money grab, similar to some of the things coming out of AC/Kage/2, etc.  Admittedly a pretty elaborate setup, but what's 20 minutes to come up with a story, throw it on a few journals, then do a couple days' follow-up when you could stand to make 5 figures?

The last thing which should ever happen is furries discover Kickstarter or ChipIn or... awww fuck, too late.  Talk about going for the low-hanging fruit.

ProvincialTwit hit another nail, probably far closer to the truthful heart of the matter.  Makes you wonder if all this was just a fabrication of disguise.  Just too many holes in the story to be legit.

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2012, 08:11:39 am »
I'm not sure that anything outside of this specific situation is related

Yeah, probably not. That's just wild conspiracy theorizing on my part...

Another possibility comes to mind - maybe the place where they were holding the event just plain got sick of furries.  I mean, it's essentially the same thing they're claiming happened, only without the oh-so-sensational reason of people getting caught screwing in public.

This. I really think they were just sick of having furries around and wanted to find a way to get rid of them... That having been said, I'm not sure that alleging that a sex crime involving minors is the best way to go about this (something about drinking, for example, would get the job done without all the messiness that comes with covering up what, in most localities, would be considered a serious crime)... But that also assumes that what's being alleged here actually happened (they've backpedaled from fursuiters having sex in public to fursuiters doing something "inappropriate" which could be anything from having sex to simply being inconveniently located near the councilman's car), and wasn't just something that was fabricated to stir up furry outrage.

After digesting the spotty initial information this whole thing smacked of a money grab, similar to some of the things coming out of AC/Kage/2, etc.

It could be that the organizers got the axe due to the budget cuts, and fabricated the story so that they could get furries to donate and save their jobs. Which would be especially convenient if the town had already told them not to come back because the neighbors were complaining about noise/drunken people passed out on cars/lawns/properties, etc. The journal here mentions that due to some unspecified "large incident" they may need to ban alcohol in the future (which is funny, because that's not mentioned anywhere else the discussion of this incident); it also seems to imply that they know who was involved, what happened, and that police were involved (from the comments: "This incident was big enough to almost result in the PD breaking it up")... Even though they now claim to have no clear idea what happened or who may have been involved... And there's no record that I can find of the police having been called to any kind of disturbance on that day. I would think that if it was something as serious as somebody potentially exposing themselves to children while dressed as a cartoon animal had actually happened, and police had been called, somebody would have been arrested (and there would be some report/charges related to the issue).

It's also possible that something did happen, but the town agreed to help sweep it under the rug... But, were that the case, why on earth would you then go on the internet and broadcast what happened to the ENTIRE WORLD?

*shrug* I just find it funny that, of all the people involved, and for all that they complain about the way they are portrayed in the media, the first people to assume the worst (and simultaneously ready the torches and pitchforks) are furries themselves. Has to be one of the most schizophrenic and/or self-loathing fandoms I have ever encountered.

Ben

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #25 on: June 22, 2012, 08:36:09 am »
So, I can't help but be slightly suspicious about all this, since I was one of the attendees, and was one of the last people to leave the FurBQ at 11pm. Essentially, what's being claimed here is that a public official was out at this barbeque past 11pm, when there were only 15 or so people still remaining, with his small children, even though most normal parents put their kids to bed before that (if they were there that late, the kids didn't get put to bed until well after midnight). If it happened before then, I imagine it would have been really difficult to keep something like that quiet. Mystery abound.

Jim Demintia

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #26 on: June 22, 2012, 08:41:56 am »
I saw a ChipIn link on Twitter
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Ben

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #27 on: June 22, 2012, 08:43:08 am »
Yeah, someone was claiming the ChipIn was frozen, but I just tested it out, and it seems to work. At least, I got to the page that allows me to submit a donation.

I will say this though-- I remember at the FurBQ, there was a fairly attractive middle-aged blonde woman with kids, the only one who brought children with her. Originally I thought she was just a furry (or the mother of someone who is a furry), but it's occurring to me now that she was likely Council Member Kristina Samonte. If someone wanted to, they could likely call that number, and ask if she was at the event, and if these events did transpire. If such is the case, then it would bring a lot of clarity to the situation.

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #28 on: June 23, 2012, 06:16:27 pm »
i lol'd Leave it to one of the trashiest states in USA. Go NJ!

Sex in public, wouldn't have done much anywhere else in USA.

Kirune

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2012, 08:37:33 am »
I will say this though-- I remember at the FurBQ, there was a fairly attractive middle-aged blonde woman with kids, the only one who brought children with her. Originally I thought she was just a furry (or the mother of someone who is a furry), but it's occurring to me now that she was likely Council Member Kristina Samonte. If someone wanted to, they could likely call that number, and ask if she was at the event, and if these events did transpire. If such is the case, then it would bring a lot of clarity to the situation.

I'll try to get in contact.

EDIT:
Quote from: xxx
I was uncategorically not in attendance at this event. My child was also uncategorically not in attendance at this event. All questions pertaining to this event, should be addressed to, Michael Herbert,West Windsor's township attorney. I have copied him on this correspondence should you wish to contact him with any further questions.
 
Regards,
Kristina Samonte
Council Member
West Windsor Township

So much for that. She Cc'd in the attorney though, I doubt it'd be worth contacting him but if any of you feel the need, I'll post his email.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 06:56:41 pm by ProvincialTwit »

Conan

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2012, 03:09:24 pm »
That email does provide the valuable insight that it seems to have actually happened. Believe me, if the furries behind this were making it up, Ms. Samonite would have either ignored the email or just said "I don't know what you're talking about", not "I wasn't there, please talk to the attorney."

greaseyote

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2012, 04:46:55 pm »
Defensive email is defensive, and highly suspicious.

I really, really want you to reply to her with "why so serious?"

Kirune

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2012, 05:29:54 pm »
It does sounds really defensive but if anyone's going to push the topic with her it won't be me.
If you wanna contact her or the attorney all their info can be found on that link ben posted.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2012, 10:59:09 am by Kirune »

ProvincialTwit

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #33 on: June 25, 2012, 06:56:23 pm »
Nope there will be none of that shit here thanks.

To clarify: I don't care what you people do on your own time but I don't want any contact info for these people posted here.

Jim Demintia

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #34 on: June 26, 2012, 06:15:16 am »
Quote
uncategorically not in attendance

wtf does that even mean
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doubtingwolf

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #35 on: June 26, 2012, 10:17:25 am »
Quote
uncategorically not in attendance

wtf does that even mean

Sounds like a plausible deniability line.  Maybe she works for the CIA?

Jim Demintia

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #36 on: June 26, 2012, 11:25:59 am »
Oh you can get the intended meaning, if you don't think about it too much. I'm sure she didn't.

(Seriously, though, this is what you get with people who hear things, don't actually know what they are/what they mean, plus a hearty dose of meth and a couple of critical brain regions missing. She is trying to issue a "categorical denial", probably on the advice of this lawyer character. Which is, as pointed out above, very odd. Perhaps this Average American Mom didn't like the weird gay nerds at this FurBQ, and used her position on the school board town council to do something that crossed ethical/legal boundaries, and now that she realizes that the shit has hit the fan, she's retained a lawyer? Dunno! But it is very odd.)
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ProvincialTwit

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2012, 12:22:44 am »
Seriously people this thread is gettin' real fuckin' dumb, real fuckin' fast.  I think you're reading way too much into the response of someone you probably shouldn't have been pestering in the first place.  For all you know, this poor woman could've been dealing with angry emails from other furfags demanding to know what happened and/or making baseless accusations about her supposed involvement in the death of the 'furbq' (ugh). 

The whole situation still smacks of an attempt by the people running the thing to convince the community (and possibly themselves) that they lost their event space and/or jobs due to the actions of some specific 'others', thereby absolving themselves and the community at large from any blame.  And the 'fundraiser' looks like an old school money grab to pay their bills while they flail around looking for work.

I'm not discounting that, perhaps, a pair of Very Special individuals decided to get their fuck on in fursuits and in public, and that has contributed to the organizer's woes.  But a lot of what's been said has already proven to be completely untrue (having more of their budget cut than was ever actually allocated?), or on shaky ground at best (someone sees two people going at it in public and calls a 'city councilman' instead of the police?).

I know it's rare these days to get such a gem of potentially hilarious drama from amidst all the commonplace furry idiocy, but seriously, calm the fuck down.

an Hoopoe

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #38 on: July 03, 2012, 11:27:35 am »
Here's a news media article:

Quote from: nj.com
A “FurBQ” party attended by guests dressed in animal costumes at the Twin “W” Rescue Squad building has drawn criticism from township officials after a couple openly engaged in unseemly behavior during the event and too many people crowded into the party, which drew a visit from the police.

Mayor Shing-Fu Hsueh called the May 26 Memorial Day barbecue “inappropriate” and said the squad’s president, Mike Leahy, subsequently met with former township administrator Bob Hary and Police Chief Joseph Pica to discuss the event, which had been held on the grounds at least once before. Leahy promised the barbecue would never take place there again, township attorney Mike Herbert said.

Herbert said the couple, who could not be identified, engaged in “inappropriate behavior.” They were spotted outside the building in the middle of the day, according to accounts of the party posted online by attendees. “People were appalled by what transpired there,” Councilman George Borek said last week.

The event was a summertime gathering for “furries,” people who like to dress in what they call “fur suits,” animal costumes that look similar to sporting mascots. The furry culture includes artists and writers who focus on anthropomorphic animals as their subjects and discuss them online. Many participants create their own characters and matching costumes that they wear to furry conferences and other events.

The West Windsor party was organized by a rescue squad volunteer who calls himself “Tony Ringtail” in postings on the site Furaffinity.net.

“West Windsor is an extremely professional organization that will not put up with any inappropriate behavior, no matter who it’s from,” Herbert said. “This should’ve never happened and will never happen again, and if it does, then the relationship between the township and the Twin W will have to be re-evaluated.” The rescue squad building and property is owned by the nonprofit Twin “W” First Aid Squad Inc. About half of the staff are paid township employees and half are volunteers.

In addition to paying employees, the township supplies ambulances and other equipment and the council recently approved $45,000 in annual funding for the group, a $15,000 increase. It was the first increase in the township’s donation in 20 years, Leahy said. According to Herbert, since Twin W owns the building and the property, the township had no say in the decision to hold the party there. And Leahy said what happened during the party had been blown out of proportion.

“Everything was kept in a back area. There was nothing in the front,” he said. “People like to fabricate, and we have no knowledge of any problem.” But he acknowledged that the party was not altogether problem-free.

“The township was concerned that there were too many people at the party. There were nearly 200 people there, so that’s a little bit too much, even for our organization,” Leahy said. He said some of the paid Twin W employees were unhappy this type of party was taking place in the building. They knew an event was planned but did not know its exact nature in advance, he said.

According to posts on the Furaffinity site, the couple’s actions took place in front of many people in the middle of the day, including children. West Windsor Lt. Pat McCormack said police were called to the party but refused to go into further detail, saying the issue was being handled as a “personnel matter.”

A YouTube video of the party, which showed guests grilling and dancing to music, drew several critical comments and video responses from self-described furries lambasting the two people involved in the incident. An online fundraising campaign was started after the barbecue and had raised close to $2,500 as of yesterday afternoon, according to the fundraising site at ChipIn.com.

“Concerned furries have started this fundraiser to help the Twin ‘W’ Rescue Squad, which used to host the NJ FurBQ, recover some of the funds that were lost during some recent unfortunate events,” the website read. According to posts by “Tony Ringtail,” the party organizer, the barbecue itself raised $300 for the squad.

A link from Ringtail’s online profile points to a defunct website that was registered to Anthony Bianca, according to a registration record. Lt. Tony Bianca, a member and administrator at the Twin W, could not be reached for comment.

http://www.nj.com/mercer/index.ssf/2012/07/animal-themed_party_at_west_wi.html

Jim Demintia

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Re: New Jersey BBQ canceled after "inappropriate" fursuiter conduct
« Reply #39 on: July 03, 2012, 12:48:42 pm »
So Tony Ringtail mixed work and furry a little too freely, the FurBQ got a little too big to control everyone...and the inevitable happened. I like how there was all kinds of pushback online to the obvious and sensible reaction "This is why I don't tell people I'm furry", but you know what? Paychecks are better than some kind of Internet philosophy argument about how being furry and being gay are the same, and that you shouldn't hide it. (For what it's worth, volunteering information about yourself is kinda awkward behavior anyway. Do you tell everyone you meet that you happen to like Android phones or Macintosh computers?)

At any rate, don't ever get into a situation where you will be held responsible for the possible misbehavior of furries. Because you will regret it.
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